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2025-04-25 12:57:17

scott@loves.tech

It seems like a lot of people have forgotten the lessons taught in Star Wars. No matter how good your intentions are, going over to the dark side will just corrupt you and taint any cause you support.

show all 17 comments

2025-04-25 14:01:37

Marshall Sutherland

dwatney@hub.farthinghalearms.com

If only people could agree on what counts as the dark side.

2025-04-25 14:27:21

BauerUlli

bauerulli@hub.netzgemeinde.eu

Give in to your anger. With each passing moment, you make yourself more my servant.

( Imperator Palpatine)

2025-04-25 20:17:24

Scott M. Stolz

scott@loves.tech

@Marshall Sutherland

If only people could agree on what counts as the dark side.

I think it is one of those things where most people can see it in others, but rarely see it in themselves.

They can point out when their enemies have crossed into the dark side, but then justify their own bad behavior as justice, or as pay back, or that they "deserve it" somehow.

It is a blind spot many people have. They cannot see how they are the same as the people they hate; the opposite side of the same coin.

2025-04-25 23:38:39

FenTiger

fentiger@zotum.net

@Scott M. Stolz "But it's different when we do it!"

"Different how?"

"You know what I mean!"

I wonder if some of the disagreement over quote posts may have been rooted in this; we should be able to quote post them, but we don't want them quote posting us...

2025-04-26 00:06:15

Scott M. Stolz

scott@loves.tech

@FenTiger Humans are weird in the sense that we can hold double standards.

And we often give ourselves a personal exemption from the rules.

It seems to be human nature since it is so widespread.

2025-04-26 00:31:46

Frank Casa

frank@frank.casa

@FenTiger

I wonder if some of the disagreement over quote posts may have been rooted in this; we should be able to quote post them, but we don't want them quote posting us...

There are some people who don't want anyone to be quoted, but I think at least some of the people are avoiding accountability. They say whatever they want, and if there is a backlash, they delete their post as if nothing happened. They don't want to be quoted since they don't want to be held accountable for their own words and actions.

But, on the flip side, you do have a problem with dogpiling and personal attacks. So there are valid reasons why some people don't want to be quoted, especially if it is something political that may not be popular. After all, just because something is popular, that does not make it right. Whether you are right or not does not affect whether you get attacked or not, in many cases.

2025-04-26 06:42:49

BauerUlli

bauerulli@hub.netzgemeinde.eu

@Frank Casa My first problem with quotes. What is it technical?
This?

They don't want to be quoted since they don't want to be held accountable for their own words and actions.

Or duplicate a whole post with my comment on it?

2025-04-26 06:49:32

Witcraft (Hubzilla)

witcraft@hub.hubzilla.de

I think people tend to forget that public posts are nothing less than a public blog, a radio or TV interview. They tend to feel they are sitting at the regulars' table and speak as they would there to their peer group - and then regret it. Decency has become a rare quality (actually, it should be there ay the regulars' tables, too).

2025-04-26 07:10:53

Scott M. Stolz

scott@loves.tech

@BauerUlli I can answer that. A quote post (or what we call a share) is someone else's post with your comments. But quoting someone with blockquotes also counts as quoting. Hubzilla and forum software like NodeBB have quoting built in and it is culturally accepted, whereas Mastodon and some other platforms don't even allow their users to use blockquotes, much less quoting someone's entire post. Mastodon is adding quote posts, but there is some controversy around it, since not everyone on Mastodon wants it.

2025-04-26 07:17:38

BauerUlli

bauerulli@hub.netzgemeinde.eu

@Scott M. Stolz Quotes are Science. Right? Read a book with on-third was references.

2025-04-26 07:43:22

Jupiter Rowland

jupiter_rowland@hub.netzgemeinde.eu

@BauerUlli That's a quote, yes. Like back in the bulletin-board forums of the 2000s and 2010s.

But it is not what half of Mastodon is enraged about. That's rather "quote-posts" which is something different, namely those copies of entire posts in other posts. We call them "shared posts". Mastodon people know them from Twitter as "quote-tweets", "QTs", "Drükos" (if the comment is above the quoted tweet) or "Drukos" (if the comment is below the quoted tweet).

And they only know them as a means of harassment of minorities by right-wing people. They cannot imagine that it's even possible that quote-posts can be used in any other way or with any other intention. That's why they don't want there to be quote-posts on Mastodon and in the Fediverse.

The same people don't even know that the Fediverse already has quote-posts. I've actually run a poll on that a while ago whether the Fediverse has quote-posts, and the majority of voters within the reach of my Friendica/Hubzilla-heavy bubble voted "No".

As for quotes, these people don't even now that quotes are possible in social media. Many have never been to forums, they don't know quotes at all. They don't perceive quotes as bad or as anything until someone from Friendica or Hubzilla or so actually quotes them.

2025-04-26 08:55:00

BauerUlli

bauerulli@hub.netzgemeinde.eu

@Jupiter Rowland Nuclear fission can be used to blow cities off the face of the earth or generate electricity. The decision is up to us. (Translated by a machine from German)

2025-04-26 16:24:04

Marshall Sutherland

dwatney@hub.farthinghalearms.com

It all sounds rather silly since I can literally use copy and paste to say:

Jupiter says "As for quotes, these people don't even now that quotes are possible in social media."

2025-04-26 20:28:48

Bill Statler

billstatler@forum.statler.ws

Take a look at the feed of popular posts on any large Mastodon instance, and see how many of them are a screenshot of somebody else's post.

2025-04-26 23:36:36

Jupiter Rowland

jupiter_rowland@hub.netzgemeinde.eu

@Marshall Sutherland This is one of the big differences between Mastodon and Hubzilla.

Mastodon users can only do what they've got buttons for, and they can only toot plain text.

Hubzilla users not only have more buttons at hand, but they can do even more things by manually typing raw code.

Another big difference:

The huge majority of Mastodon users is mostly or exclusively on phones. Many don't know what copy-paste is because they've never used an actual computer, only ever phones instead. For the rest, copy-paste is too fumbly to bother, what with the touch screen being their only input device. Thus, unless Mastodon users get a quote or quote-post button, the only halfway convenient way for them to quote anything is by tooting a screenshot with no alt-text.

On Hubzilla, everyone's on desktop and laptop computers with hardware keyboards and dedicated pointing devices. Copy-paste is a breeze here.

#Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Mastodon #Hubzilla

2025-04-27 09:46:02

Phil Bass

phil@hub.hubzilla.de

Thanks @Jupiter Rowland. I've learnt something today.

2025-04-27 16:16:05

Scott M. Stolz

scott@loves.tech

@Jupiter Rowland That is a factor, but even if we had a native mobile app, we would still have more feature, just like the Facebook app has more features than the Twitter/X and Mastodon apps. Part of it is because Mastodon is modelled after Twitter, and Twitter never was feature-rich.